E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups?

pmurphy · 08-18-2013, 10:07 PM

Well it appears that what I have is an E. 'Maurelii'. Now the question is do I even try to separate the pups (and if so at what age) or just leave them? - there are 5 total with the tallest being about 8 - 10 inches.

stevelau1911 · 08-18-2013, 10:37 PM

I think it should be fine to separate the larger ones, but just leaving the little ones attached at least until they form roots.

I currently have 30 inch tall ensete maureliis with 4-5 inch fat stems, and 1ft+ diameter leaves, but I'm thinking about causing one of them to pup when it really gets up in size, and has a long season ahead to get nice sized pups so I'm guessing the best time to destroy the meri-stem is probably right around May so they can be outside and have plenty of time over the summer to get nice big pups that can already be divided up by July.

I just don't feel that they are big enough to force to pup yet. In case you were interested, here's one of mine growing short and stocky.

Olafhenny · 08-19-2013, 07:15 PM

Hi Pmurphy,

How did you get these pups? Did you have to cut off the p-stem of the mother plant? And if so,
when? I am in the early stages of an experiment trying to get pups without killing the mom.
I only started a week ago and intent to post a write-up with pictures, once I know if there
is any success or not. My mother plant is still quite young, but I wanted to start early enough,
to allow some time for the pups (if any) to develop before frost. I live in HZ6 (Penticton).

As far as your question is concerned, I would wait a bit longer, if you also want to save the
small ones.

Good luck,
Olaf

pmurphy · 08-19-2013, 08:05 PM

Its a long story but the original plant was very sick when I got it and badly abused by insects and rot (I could not even tell what type of banana it was supposed to be). After a year and half I had finally given up on the plant but just never got around to throwing it out so the pot sat while what was left slowly disintegrated. When I looked about a month ago this is what had came up - and I think there is a sixth pup now starting to grow.
Now I'm not sure what to do with it/them.....

Olafhenny · 08-19-2013, 09:28 PM

If they were mine, I would keep them for a while together and then raise them, if I had room
(which I haven't). But I would keep them anyway for experimentation: Will they survive the
winter in Vancouver with minimal protection or do you have to upgrade the protection as
compared to the Basjoo? There really appears to be little known about that in this forum.

I think you indicate, that you have them in a pot. Do you raise bananas outdoors at all?

Olaf

stevelau1911 · 08-19-2013, 11:46 PM

They supposively have stem cells within the corm around the basal plate so if you take a chunk or pie out of the ensete without destroying the meristem ensuring that you keep many roots intact, you should be able to get a piece that is capable of producing pups.

I think it's important to leave on a lot of the attached leaves which can also be a source of starch, but have the section high enough so that it can drain well. It's probably better to just hold it off until the spring because unless you have a heated greenhouse, or nice strong lights, you probably wouldn't want a bunch of little pups going into the winter which are tough to over-winter.

pmurphy · 08-20-2013, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olafhenny

If they were mine, I would keep them for a while together and then raise them, if I had room
(which I haven't). But I would keep them anyway for experimentation: Will they survive the
winter in Vancouver with minimal protection or do you have to upgrade the protection as
compared to the Basjoo? There really appears to be little known about that in this forum.

I think you indicate, that you have them in a pot. Do you raise bananas outdoors at all?

Olaf

They are currently in a 5 gallon pot and I actually have several options for the winter. I can either:
1) bring them in the house with a few of the really tender tropicals fruits trees that I have
2) move them into my newly erected covered "garden" which will be dry and frost free (I suspect this one would be more stable temperature wise because of its size - 16ft x 9.5ft x 7.5ft in height)
3) move them into the heated greenhouse, but it tends to be on the humid side.
Being their first winter I'm leaning towards bring them into the house but we will see what happens.

As for Vancouver winters, I do have another 4ft e. maurelii that is inground in my front yard that I'm going to try wrapping to see how it handles the winter. And I currently have the following variety of banana inground: m. basjoo, m. 'caligold', m. 'mekong giant', m. zebrina 'rojo', m. 'grand nain', e. glaucum and musella lasiocarpa (as well as the 4ft e. maurelii)......and I also have some more tender varieties in pots. Of those inground some require extra protection and the others do not. The potted ones will now be moved into the "garden".....beats trying to keep them and us happy in the house for all those months

cannasrus · 09-19-2013, 07:10 PM

I was wandering about wintering them my self? Indoors didnt work well for me last year

pmurphy · 09-20-2013, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cannasrus

I was wandering about wintering them my self? Indoors didnt work well for me last year

Due to the size of the group - they seem to be growing rapidly and there are now about a dozen pups in the pot with the tallest measuring over 2ft tall - I decided to move them into the "garden". We placed an extra layer of poly over the entire greenhouse to create an insulating air pocket and it seems to be keeping the conditions pretty stable so far. We have also been monitoring the temperature via a wireless digital thermometer and have noted the lowest nightly temperature to date has been about 11C (~55F). I have also noted that since the pot was moved in about 2 weeks ago that their growth rate has not slowed down yet.
I think one additional advantage of keeping it in the "garden" is the fact that they will get more natural lighting. Whenever we bring plants into the house I find they tend to dry out due to the lack of humidity and they get "leggie" because the lighting in not right (we do place grow lights over them to help with this but you can always tell which plants spent the winter indoor)........I also find that the plants that spend the winter indoors must be gently acclimated to the sun when they go outside otherwise they will burn.

My next project in a couple of weeks will be to protect the e. maurelii that will be staying in ground.......wish me luck on this one

Nate74 · 09-20-2013, 12:26 PM

Good luck over wintering the one in the ground. Take lots of pics so I know what to do next year

pmurphy · 09-20-2013, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate74

Good luck over wintering the one in the ground. Take lots of pics so I know what to do next year

Will keep you posted on that one!

Olafhenny · 09-20-2013, 01:41 PM

I am also intending to winter my Maurelii outside in HZ6 with the help of my permanent shelter
seen here: Permanent banana shelter for winter and spring and my already installed
"passive heating system" (PHS), which is just a fancy name for a simple device permitting the
warmth of lower level of the earth to rise into the shelter.

I will write more about that PHS, when I report on my Maurelii propagation experiment, which
has already partially failed, not necessarily because my experiment was flawed, but because
my after care was lacking.

I will write more, before I put the Maurelii “to bed” and after I wake it up in spring. It will be
interesting to compare notes with pmurphy (no first name?) in spring.
Olaf

pmurphy · 09-20-2013, 04:25 PM

Thanks Olaf, I will be very much interested in comparing notes with you in the spring......Penticton is not only cold than Vancouver much drier in the winter. I'll be interesting to see which one of us has more success.
Pam

Olafhenny · 09-20-2013, 06:24 PM

Hi Pam,
speaking of Penticton being dryer than Vancouver, I have a flowering ginger, which I have
nursed now for 2½ years along under “drying conditions”. I would really like to foster it
off to somebody in the Lower Mainland, since I am not really prepared to pamper it through
another winter. It is now finally starting to get ready to bloom. The problem is, that I am
not planning to drive down there anytime soon and if, I would not know whom to give it
to. It appears to me, that you have all the facilities (actually down there non are required
other than a bit of warmth during winter) to accommodate it. So if you want it and know
somebody, who
plans to visit the Okanagan anywhere south of Kelowna, I would be able to deliver it there.

More about how I got it and what it looks like here:
My quest for ginger
I started the thread so it is just in the first few posts

I also have several small M. Ornata to give away. They are small enough for anybody’s
living room, even in an apartment, graceful and actually have done for me better indoors
than outside (the sun shining on the pots make it too hot).

How I got the Ornata and what they look like “at home” you can see here:
I Think I Scored a Coup (I was still relatively new to bananas
then, and had never heard of a banana small enough for living rooms)

And here is what they look like in a more protective environment:

I just have now too many of them. That goes for Basjoos too, but you probably have some
of those already.

Best,
Olaf

08-18-2013, 10:07 PM	#1 (permalink)
pmurphy always pushing the limits Location: Vancouver, BC Canada Find me on the map! Zone: 8B Name: Pam Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 344 BananaBucks : 56,916 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 168 Times Was Thanked 512 Times in 214 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 1,312 Times	E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Well it appears that what I have is an E. 'Maurelii'. Now the question is do I even try to separate the pups (and if so at what age) or just leave them? - there are 5 total with the tallest being about 8 - 10 inches.

08-18-2013, 10:37 PM	#2 (permalink)
stevelau1911 stevelau1911's Photo Gallery Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 458 BananaBucks : 147,411 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 51 Times Was Thanked 561 Times in 258 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 24 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? I think it should be fine to separate the larger ones, but just leaving the little ones attached at least until they form roots. I currently have 30 inch tall ensete maureliis with 4-5 inch fat stems, and 1ft+ diameter leaves, but I'm thinking about causing one of them to pup when it really gets up in size, and has a long season ahead to get nice sized pups so I'm guessing the best time to destroy the meri-stem is probably right around May so they can be outside and have plenty of time over the summer to get nice big pups that can already be divided up by July. I just don't feel that they are big enough to force to pup yet. In case you were interested, here's one of mine growing short and stocky. __________________ I'm in zone 6 upstate NY, specialize in growing temperate cold hardy bamboos(mainly phyllostachys) and starting to get into bananas. my picture website is http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/ http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

08-19-2013, 07:15 PM	#3 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 252,154 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Hi Pmurphy, How did you get these pups? Did you have to cut off the p-stem of the mother plant? And if so, when? I am in the early stages of an experiment trying to get pups without killing the mom. I only started a week ago and intent to post a write-up with pictures, once I know if there is any success or not. My mother plant is still quite young, but I wanted to start early enough, to allow some time for the pups (if any) to develop before frost. I live in HZ6 (Penticton). As far as your question is concerned, I would wait a bit longer, if you also want to save the small ones. Good luck, Olaf __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

08-19-2013, 08:05 PM	#4 (permalink)
pmurphy always pushing the limits Location: Vancouver, BC Canada Find me on the map! Zone: 8B Name: Pam Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 344 BananaBucks : 56,916 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 168 Times Was Thanked 512 Times in 214 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 1,312 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Its a long story but the original plant was very sick when I got it and badly abused by insects and rot (I could not even tell what type of banana it was supposed to be). After a year and half I had finally given up on the plant but just never got around to throwing it out so the pot sat while what was left slowly disintegrated. When I looked about a month ago this is what had came up - and I think there is a sixth pup now starting to grow. Now I'm not sure what to do with it/them.....

08-19-2013, 09:28 PM	#5 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 252,154 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? If they were mine, I would keep them for a while together and then raise them, if I had room (which I haven't). But I would keep them anyway for experimentation: Will they survive the winter in Vancouver with minimal protection or do you have to upgrade the protection as compared to the Basjoo? There really appears to be little known about that in this forum. I think you indicate, that you have them in a pot. Do you raise bananas outdoors at all? Olaf __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

Members currently in the chatroom: 0
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08-19-2013, 11:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
stevelau1911 stevelau1911's Photo Gallery Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 458 BananaBucks : 147,411 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 51 Times Was Thanked 561 Times in 258 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 24 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? They supposively have stem cells within the corm around the basal plate so if you take a chunk or pie out of the ensete without destroying the meristem ensuring that you keep many roots intact, you should be able to get a piece that is capable of producing pups. I think it's important to leave on a lot of the attached leaves which can also be a source of starch, but have the section high enough so that it can drain well. It's probably better to just hold it off until the spring because unless you have a heated greenhouse, or nice strong lights, you probably wouldn't want a bunch of little pups going into the winter which are tough to over-winter. __________________ I'm in zone 6 upstate NY, specialize in growing temperate cold hardy bamboos(mainly phyllostachys) and starting to get into bananas. my picture website is http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/ http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

09-19-2013, 07:10 PM	#8 (permalink)
cannasrus Location: southwestern Indiana zone 6 Find me on the map! Zone: zone 6 Name: Buddy T Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 88 BananaBucks : 20,003 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 596 Times Was Thanked 80 Times in 38 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 43 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? I was wandering about wintering them my self? Indoors didnt work well for me last year __________________ A regular ride is better than a dressed up walk.

09-20-2013, 12:26 PM	#10 (permalink)
Nate74 Location: Abbotsford BC Find me on the map! Zone: 8B Elevation 133m/436ft Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 84 BananaBucks : 36,455 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 113 Times Was Thanked 243 Times in 60 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 91 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Good luck over wintering the one in the ground. Take lots of pics so I know what to do next year __________________

09-20-2013, 01:41 PM	#12 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 252,154 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? I am also intending to winter my Maurelii outside in HZ6 with the help of my permanent shelter seen here: Permanent banana shelter for winter and spring and my already installed "passive heating system" (PHS), which is just a fancy name for a simple device permitting the warmth of lower level of the earth to rise into the shelter. I will write more about that PHS, when I report on my Maurelii propagation experiment, which has already partially failed, not necessarily because my experiment was flawed, but because my after care was lacking. I will write more, before I put the Maurelii “to bed” and after I wake it up in spring. It will be interesting to compare notes with pmurphy (no first name?) in spring. Olaf __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

09-20-2013, 04:25 PM	#13 (permalink)
pmurphy always pushing the limits Location: Vancouver, BC Canada Find me on the map! Zone: 8B Name: Pam Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 344 BananaBucks : 56,916 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 168 Times Was Thanked 512 Times in 214 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 1,312 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Thanks Olaf, I will be very much interested in comparing notes with you in the spring......Penticton is not only cold than Vancouver much drier in the winter. I'll be interesting to see which one of us has more success. Pam

09-20-2013, 06:24 PM	#14 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 252,154 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: E. Maurelii - should I try to separate the pups? Hi Pam, speaking of Penticton being dryer than Vancouver, I have a flowering ginger, which I have nursed now for 2½ years along under “drying conditions”. I would really like to foster it off to somebody in the Lower Mainland, since I am not really prepared to pamper it through another winter. It is now finally starting to get ready to bloom. The problem is, that I am not planning to drive down there anytime soon and if, I would not know whom to give it to. It appears to me, that you have all the facilities (actually down there non are required other than a bit of warmth during winter) to accommodate it. So if you want it and know somebody, who plans to visit the Okanagan anywhere south of Kelowna, I would be able to deliver it there. More about how I got it and what it looks like here: My quest for ginger I started the thread so it is just in the first few posts I also have several small M. Ornata to give away. They are small enough for anybody’s living room, even in an apartment, graceful and actually have done for me better indoors than outside (the sun shining on the pots make it too hot). How I got the Ornata and what they look like “at home” you can see here: I Think I Scored a Coup (I was still relatively new to bananas then, and had never heard of a banana small enough for living rooms) And here is what they look like in a more protective environment: I just have now too many of them. That goes for Basjoos too, but you probably have some of those already. Best, Olaf __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

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