mnorell

I'm in the midst of trialing a lot of supposedly cold-hardier Heliconias in our bottom-of-9a climate, and today happened to glance toward one of my Heliconia latispatha 'Distans' and to my complete surprise there is a bloom emerging! This plant was received as a rhizome from Puerto Rico in April, potted in roughly 60/40 sand/Miracle-Gro Potting Soil mix in hot sun, began sprouting and growing the first week of May, and went in the ground about a month ago in a protected south-facing spot with about 4-5 hours of fairly intense sun per day.

So it is exactly four months for this plant from rhizome to flower. I do still have another plant in a shadier bed that hasn't bloomed yet but I'll keep my eye on it...but at least this shows the plant is fully capable of going from a fairly small rhizome to a plant 2-3 feet tall with lots of pups now emerging from the soil, up to 9" away from the center of the mat. That makes it just about a month slower to flower than the quickest-blooming specimens of psittacorum 'Andromeda' I sprouted simultaneously with these 'Distans' rhizomes (though about half of the 'Andromeda' plants have yet to flower). And may I say much more spectacular in flower than any psittacorum as well!

Now the test will be to see if the rhizomes can survive the winter...perhaps someone else here can weigh in with their experiences in the Gulf-states 9a belt with this or any other Heliconia, and whether they've been successfully overwintered and bloomed. Here are pix from today of the plant and its just-emerging inflorescence:

MediaHound

Very nice, congrats! And a very warm welcome!

We do have some resident Heliconia experts, hopefully you all can put your heads together and share some tips as far as the cold hardy heliconias go.

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Apologies in advance if I am slow to reply to your PM. I suggest posting in the forums for support if you need something urgent.

STEELVIPER

I grow a few heliconia's here in Zone 9B. Not the cold hardy species, but a few of the picky warm climate species. My rostrata bloomed this year. Next year i hope to get my "edge of night" and my "guyana" to bloom. All container grown.

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Steve L

Congrats on the bloom. This is definitely the peak bloom time of year for Latispatha Distans. If you look in my photo gallery, there is a picture of mine from a few weeks ago. I've grown this heliconia for 6 or 7 years. It has bloomed every year starting in year 2. I greenhouse this heliconia during the winter here in Lake Charles, LA as it is not at all cold hardy in Zone 9a. It's taller cousin, Latispatha Orange Gyro, is probably root hardy here but the chance of blooms on that one would not be good as it blooms on second year growth. Your Psitt. Andromeda is definitely not cold hardy either. In fact, all Psitts are extremely difficult to over winter and will not make it in the ground in this zone. I grow many, many more heliconia; some in ground, but most in pots. The most cold hardy of them all is Schiedeana, but in the right place, in a protected spot, with maybe a frost cloth to cover if it drops into the upper 20's, you might be able to grow and bloom Rostrata, Pedro Ortiz, Subulata, Spissa, or Red Angusta. All of the heliconia I grow that are in ground are protected with a portable greenhouse erected over the plant. Currently, I am growing Rostrata, Pedro Ortiz, Schiedeana, Orange Schiedean, Eden Pink, Golden Torch, Subulata, Sharonii, Oriole Orange, Las Cruces, Sexy Pink, Hirsuta, Red Angusta, Distans, Valentine, Maya Blood, Orange Gyro. I've bloomed most but not all. I've killed another 3 dozen or so over the years so if you need to know what not to do, I can probably help.

Steve

mnorell

Thanks, MediaHound, for the warm welcome.

Steve--

I'm not buoyed by your observation that 'Distans' won't make it over the winter here. Have you tried it in multiple positions and drainage/soil-mix combos to be sure? It seems odd to me that the taller latispathas would be root-hardy but this one not. Though perhaps it’s a natural hybrid with a more tender species? I'm going to test mine in two places this winter and see what happens, but I'm taking your comments to heart and will report back...we're about 3-4 degrees cooler on average in winter, I think, than you are, so it may be a real struggle for these guys. We're consistently about 2 degrees cooler than Baton Rouge in this downtown area of Natchez near the river. And usually very similar minima at my house in this downtown Natchez microclimate and at BTR airport. Typically one or two nights of low-to-mid 20s per year (last three winter lows have been 24/27/23), but as you know the whole region can suffer much worse in a killer winter. And then there’s that often-lethal sustained chill of December-January-February with rain. Dang!

Here are those I’m trialing this winter in the ground:
H. aemygdiana
H. angusta ‘Holiday’ (am hoping for a stray October/November bloom on this one and some root hardiness at least)
H. aurantiaca (a weak grower so far, and I believe a winter-bloomer so don’t hold out hope)
H. champneiana 'Maya Blood'
H. collinsiana
H. latispatha 'orange gyro'
H. latispatha 'red-yellow'
H. latispatha 'distans'
H. lingulata 'red tip fan'
H. lingulata 'spiral'
H. richardiana 'Little Richard'
H. rostrata (I really don’t hold out hopes for a bloom on this one)
H. schiediana
H. subulata

and Hybrids:
H. collinseana x bourgeana 'Pedro Ortiz'
H. psitt. x spathocircinata 'Guyana'


I have most of these in protected south/southwest exposures in raised beds with plenty of sand amended to the soil.

What is your experience with subulata? These can supposedly take a good amount of chill, and I’m assuming they will bloom on a single season’s growth. Mine are finally taking off (I have two clumps). Aside from ‘Distans’ and subulata, I know that most of these are second-season bloomers, but I’ve been told that an established clump of latispatha can throw blooms in one season. Also lingulata. And I’ve heard from a number of S.F. Bay-area growers that there’s a good group (including some of the above) that will tolerate their wet, chilly winters, on a par with what we have here. But at least our chill lasts only three months, not five or six.

I do know that the psittacorum types are not root-hardy here…when visiting from California, and then upon moving here to Natchez a few years ago, I was amazed to see the huge clumps of blooming psittacorum outside every McDonald’s in South and Central Louisiana (who’s responsible for that?), and assumed that these behaved like root-hardy perennials. I’ve now learned that they’re annuals only! Eric Schmidt at Leu Gardens says that none except perhaps ‘Andromeda’ are reliably root-hardy even in balmy Orlando. But at least we can have them bloom all summer and into fall for the price of some rhizome sections or a relatively inexpensive plant at a nursery/big-box store.

I’ve also heard that hirsuta, mathiasae, spissa and vaginalis may be candidates for surviving a chilly winter, and some of the high-elevation species like lankesteri—and if I can find them, they may constitute next year’s trials. Perhaps you’ve had experience with some of the above and can give some advice…would love to hear your experiences in more detail, and how you site them, in what soil, etc. Have you never found any root-hardy Heliconias that would flower in a single season?

Steve L

I have never tried Distans in the ground but a friend of mine in L.A. says it won't grow for him but Orange Gyro will. One winter night, I left the pot on my covered and protected patio rather than haul it to the greenhouse and it croaked when the temps dropped below freezing. Granted, it was in a pot which makes it more cold sensitive but it was right next to two large pots of Rostrata and they survived and bloomed the following summer.

I haven't gotten Subulata to bloom size; the cold keeps knocking it down to the ground and the growth process just starts over again in the spring. The rhizome mass isn't large enough to get the stalks to bloom size in one growing season but I think you make a valid point about an established clump of Orange Gyro (or any other heliconia for that matter) producing blooms in one season. I have experienced this with Rostrata. However, the blooms are very punky compared to the normal size bloom and the full effect of the whole stand in bloom is lost. Even in years of mild winters, most of these heliconia will at some point during the winter, cease new growth on the old, mature stalks even if they were not frosted and start new regrowth from the rhizome when it warms up. Once the old stalks aborts, then you are out of luck with a bloom on that stalk. Secondly, one of these marginally cold hardy heliconia might get frozen but be root hardy and show new growth in the spring but it is never as strong of a plant as it was before the freeze and will eventually expire the following winter. You mention Hirsuta and that heliconia is a good example of one that will come back but be much weaker and then die the following winter. All of the heliconia I have in the ground are on the south side of my house with an oak canopy for frost protection and surrounded by masses of other plants. I have NEVER gotten a heliconia grown in the ground that survived the winter to bloom the following year; except Schiedeana. That's why I use so many temporary greenhouses.

I've seen those commercial establishments with large Psittacorum plantings and the only thing I can figure out is that the landscaper has a nursery license and buys tissue culture plants. Psitts. and maybe the Distans are the only heliconia that can bloom on one years growth. In some cases, it has taken me three years to bloom a heliconia in a pot.

Steve

mnorell

Steve—

Thanks for that great info. I’ll certainly post the results next spring with ‘Distans’…as I do still hold out some hope for it.

The trouble with comparing California and the Gulf States is that they are just completely different worlds. I lived in SoCal for the first 42 years of my life, and I can say after three years that this climate is just wildly different. Those three cold months seem to devastate most tropicals, but for the other nine months what’s amazing is how herbaceous tropicals (and woody perennials or self-seeding annuals, e.g. Senna alata) can grow into whopping, lush specimens here, even when frosted back or frozen to the ground completely. In Southern California, most of these plants may limp along but fail to thrive even in frost-free areas unless they have high-elevation provenance and a lot of soil-amendment and watering in the growing season. I wasn’t growing Curcumas and Costus there but my understanding is that many of them don’t perform well there, while many thrive here.

In California, Heliconia schiediana is a proven performer and I had nice blooms every May, but the foliage didn’t like the dry air and wind (and this is why the large stands at the Huntington always look nasty). I could never get my hands on any latispatha in those days; and the Heliconias that I imported from Hawai’i croaked (rostrata died a slower death) with the cool/cold night temps there for so much of the year. There the ornamental bananas grow but slowly and really seem to sulk unless pampered in just the right microclimate. I remember a stand of Musa ornata in Hollywood that would finally start blooming each year about September as temps warmed. Plants were maybe 5’ tall. They would persist since they were in a frost-free area, but they just looked awful. Here I have stands of ornata that are 12’ tall or more with massive blooms. I reduce the mats year after year and they just keep coming back more spectacular than ever. There’s a lot of discussion that many plants can build up a strong carbohydrate-store during the warmth and humidity here and that helps them survive the winters and come back strong the next year. That’s why I’m thinking your friend may have had a bad experience with ‘Distans’ in L.A. But here it may be able to endure the three or so months of cold soil if the water can be kept away from it. I do plan to mound/mulch these with sand. Nevertheless your experience with a potted specimen on a protected porch makes it obvious that it’s not bulletproof by any means, certainly not in comparison with rostrata.

Do you have any experience with the psitt/spathocircinata hybrids, like ‘Guyana’ and ‘Golden Torch’? I’ve got Guyana in the ground, kept it barely alive in a rootbound pot for two years and finally put the last struggling bit of it into the ground. Now it’s almost 3’ tall and a healthy, thick clump. Am wondering if I can expect flowers this year and perhaps whether the spathocircinata blood imparts the possibility of root hardiness to the normally wimpy psittacorum genes.

Steve L

I'm in full agreement with you about the differences in SoCal and the Gulf Coast but this guy has bloomed Rostrata in the ground as well. Our disadvantage is the latter half of the month of Dec and the month of January. Their disadvantage is low humidity, cool temps at night through out the year and an irregular supply of rain. The Gulf Coast for the rest of the time other than Dec. Jan and part of Feb would be nearly perfect for tropicals.

I've tried Golden Torch in the ground and it comes back with a mild winter but is weak. If a normal winter follows, then it will just disappear. It's back in a pot now and enormous. It has two huge bloom cycles for me; one in the spring and one now and only blooms intermitently during the summer. But please don't be discouraged because you may find a solution with the right soil mixture, an elevated bed, or something else. If you do, I hope like hell you share it with me. I've been groiwng Tacca Integrifolia in the ground in a protected spot for 3 years and it blooms every fall for me. In bloom right now. I just happened to find the right place with the right conditions. I killed three others in pots so it's possible. It's certainly not supposed to grow in zone 9.

I would do the best I could to protect your heliconia this winter with frost cloth, a blanket, when the temps drop to below 40. If you can shield them from too much moisture during cold fronts by placing a large pot over them to protect the roots from too much rain, maybe that will work. Or you can do like I do and cover them with a portable greenhouse either purchased over the internet or constructed with PVC pipe and 6mm plastic. In most cases, you don't even have to add supplemental heat until the temps drop below freezing.

Steve

Steve

southlatropical

I was wondering what was going on with those heliconia planted around my local McDonalds (Port Allen LA). They have been blooming for months planted in the ground next to the drive through. I wonder if they buried pots and are going to dig them up for winter. I'm going to try the temporary greenhouse thing this winter. I have some Rostrata in a pot and I planted some in the ground next to my white BOP. I'm going to cover both of them this winter. Steve, when you put a heater in the portable greenhouse do you have problems with the plants drying out? Do you have to use a humidifier?

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Steve L

Southlatropical,

I've not had a problem with the plants covered by the portable greenhouse drying out. The area is heavily mulched and a quick spray of water usually does the trick. I have had problems in my permanent greenhouse with a lack of humidity but rigged up a soaker hose on a timer (3 times a day) and that solved the problem. The floor of the permanent greenhouse is gravel.

Steve

Kylie2x

Hey!!!
Welcome and Congrats on your bloom...Great pic...
I am fairly new to the world of Heliconias...Can I keep these under the house with steady temps of 56* ..and have any chance of blooms the following season or will they need to be housed?
Kylie

Steve L

Kylie,

Unfortunately, heliconia don't have a dormant period so storing them as you sugggest won't work.

Steve

Kylie2x

Thanks Steve!!! That is what I thought.. I only have 4 or 5 so finding a place somewhere inside shouldn't be that big a problem....

mnorell

Steve—

Beware, this is a long post!

When you’ve grown your Golden Torch and hirsutas in the ground, did you ever try them against south walls, in raised beds in sandy soil, and did you mulch/mound them heavily, etc., to help them out? You say you’ve had your Heliconias under live oaks and surrounded by lots of other plants, but I wonder about the drainage issue and how much winter sun-exposure they have received, as that really appears vital to their survival. I’m hoping I’ve gone far enough in prepping the soil around these and siting them intelligently. But as you say, you never quite know until you’ve tried it several times. I had supposedly hardy things rot in the ground last winter (‘Borneo Giant’ Alocasia, ‘Thousand Finger’ banana, some usually hardy Curcuma, etc.), and I chalk it up to planting small plants too late in the season, in lower spots where water gathers, in heavy soil and too much shade, etc. I can see with these Heliconias that planting up against that south side of the house is very beneficial. Also my own limited experience is that just about all Heliconias hate being bound in pots. They either sulk or push and shove their way out, run out of water constantly when pot-bound, and seem to be so decimated by mealy bugs and spider mites as well as dry air in winter that I wonder if they wouldn’t be happier in that chilly earth outside!

That’s fascinating about the Tacca, and congratulations on your success with it. How is it sited? They usually say, kill something three times before you write it off…luckily you tried four with this one! That’s great news. What a fascinating plant that is. Also I’m very impressed with your photos of Musa coccinea, I assume from your garden. I have struggled with that plant, lost a small one last winter and this year have two larger mats in the ground, this time amended with lots of sand and peat, and they’re actually getting some size on them, but they’re still a bit fragile-looking and I’m beginning to despair that I’ll see a bloom this year, it seems to grow more vigorously with just a bit of shade from the hot afternoon sun. Perhaps it will surprise me in the next few weeks, I’d like to know your secret!

Most of the Heliconias are up against the south/southwest front of the house, some under the partial protection of some Tetrapanax (which will last until a hard freeze) and some lightly protective Caesalpinia mexicana/yucatanensis trees, as well as the eaves of the house (though it’s a tall two-story).

Do you have experiences you can share about these particular species I've got growing in the test-bed:

Collinsiana: I have my collinsiana under some Tetrapanax, very sheltered up against the house in a good amount of shade, and it really slugged along at first, then threw a pup and now it’s five feet tall. Beautiful with the white powder under the leaf. I’m curious if you’ve ever tried it, it’s supposed to be pretty cold-hardy and shade-tolerant but I’m sure it’s a second-season bloomer.

Angusta ‘Red Holiday’: I have a large, dense clump of this next to the Collinsiana under the Tetrapanax. Very sheltered and shady…do you know at what temp these leaves and stalks fry in a protected place? Also have you ever seen blooms in the fall, as early as October, from stalks that emerged in spring? I know you use the greenhouse so perhaps you don’t have accurate info for a plant in such as a condition as I have, but it would be good to know. Also whether the yellow and orange versions are as hardy and whether they perhaps bloom a little earlier. Have you tried these?

‘Pedro Ortiz’: in much more sun and has grown like a weed, it is 5’ tall with huge leaves; I’ve been told by my rhizome supplier not to expect it to bloom the first year from the rhizome, and I think you’ve basically corroborated that info.

lingulata: this is out in full sun and really getting huge now; this one according to Eric Schmidt will bloom in a single season—have you ever tried this to see if it’s root-hardy?) Have you seen the ‘Kampong’ variety? Spectacular!

latispatha ‘Orange Gyro’: getting pretty large, it grows steadily but not monstrously, but is now 5’ tall with large leaves and a number of stalks.
Richardiana ‘Little Richard’: this is still in a pot as it was weak from the rhizome stage, and is just now seeming a little stronger. A more unusual species, I think, but I get the impression it can possibly bloom in a season. I have some red-yellow in the ground also, do you think it's got the same hardiness?

subulata: one of these has now thrown new pups that are about 3’ tall with about 4-5 very large leaves after two months in the ground, I think I counted 7 leaves at Fairchild on the subulatas there beneath each inflorescence, though their leaves were not as large as these, they may have been a little stressed. Mine are in manure and sand.

schiediana: I have put mine right up against the house near a bank of gallery windows, it doesn’t get much sun in winter, but I’m interested that you say you’ve gotten it to flower in a single season. Did I read that right? Perhaps it’s more stem-hardy than the others and can take down to mid-20s and keep growing? In California, this always took two seasons for me and the blooms emerged like clockwork in May.
Have you ever tried mathiasae or vaginalis, these appear to both be in the subulata/psittacorum type of mold, in terms of general flower-appearance and height, and supposedly do have a good degree of chill tolerance. But again I don’t know if they’ll flower in a single season. Curious to know if you’ve tried these.

There are a few others that pique my interest, some are complete gambles like lutea, thomasiana, and others that supposedly have some hardiness like pendula, spothocircinata (the colder-hardy parent of all those ‘Golden Torch’ type hybrids), spissa, etc. Perhaps you’ve had a chance to test some of these?

Thanks for any info you (and perhaps anyone else who has tried these) can give on the long laundry-list above, and I of course will share with you what if anything survives next year. Just really bummed to hear, though, that subulata never manages to get to blooming before the cold knocks it down. Sounds like Musa beccarii! I’m hoping that one of my two subulata clumps will find its site amenable enough to throw some blooms.

Michael

Steve L

Michael,

I'll try to address each of your questions and comments.

All of my heliconia in the ground are being grown on the south side of a two story house. Golden Torch and Hirsuta Costa Flores are two that are up against the house. They are well mulched; however, there may be a drainage issue and this could have led to the demise of Golden Torch and the punkiness of Hirsuta. Your question of sun is an extremely valid one. Although the live oak canopy protects these plants from frost; since they are further south of the south facing wall of the house, the low southern sun angle in the winter doesn't permit good sunlight to hit them. The soil is definitely sandy enough and the beds are raised. You mentioned Borneo Giant; mine croaked last winter. I also lost Zingiber Neglectum Jewel Pagoda and Hedychium X Kong. I had been growing these gingers for numerous years. We received a tremendous amount of rain during the winter.

The White Bat plant is being grown in a bed on my courtyard up against a south facing wall and under a ligustrum. It is protected on all 4 sides. From what I've read about the growing conditions in India (I believe) is that it grows under the tropical canopy in heavily organic and decaying leaf mulch. Mine is heavily mulched and since I keep the ligustrums trimmed up the branches with about 2 feet of leaves on the top (mushroom looking), the dead leaves are constantly dropping to the ground. Yes, that is my Musa Coccinea in my yard and I have never had a problem with this banana. It is a regular bloomer. It took a big hit last winter when we dropped to 24 a couple of times but came back strong. It is just now putting out it's first bloom; oddly enough on the shortest stalk. The blooms in the fall are more orange. The blooms in the spring, if not killed back, are the typical red color you see in pictures. I really like this banana. Musa Beccarii is a no go for me. It won't make it here in Lake Charles.

I have never tried Collinsiana but do have some seedlings given to me by a friend and I'm going to put them in my greenhouse this winter. Red Angusta begins to show signs of cold damage at 38. It has never bloomed for me at Christmas; more like Valentine's Day. The blooms do start showing up around December but are never fully open. I've never seen blooms in October or any signs of blooms in October. I haven't tried the Yellow or Orange versions but I have a friend in Florida that says the Yellow one is much easier to grow than the red one. Pedro Ortiz, I find is extremely cold hardy. Right next to Schiedeana in my opinion. Maybe its the cross of Collinsiana and Bourgeana, I don't know. It took 24 with some leaf burn a few years ago before I had the large portable greenhouse and bloomed the following summer. At the time, it was planted right up against the south wall, next to my fireplace chimney and received good morning sun that wasn't blocked by the oak trees. I have not tried Lingulata. Latispatha Orange Gyro has the abililty to bloom in one season if the planting is large enough. I've not gotten Subulata to bloom yet; it's a two year old plant but probably doesn't get enough sun. Yes, I've gotten Schiedeana to bloom in a single season after loosing the mature stalks to the cold. The stalks that bloomed were stalks that were already growing but not as tall as the mature ones which actually served to protect them. You can really give any of these heliconia in the ground a huge jump start be feeding them composted chicken manure. I fould this out quite by accident as one stand of Schiedeana is next to my Ae Ae which gets the chicken manure and the run off of the water from the Ae Ae made the stalks of the heliconia near it grow twice as fast as the stalks on the other side of the stand. This stand of Schiedeana is probably 5 feet by 5 feet. I haven't tried Mathiasae or Vaginalis but I did try Fernandezii and had a great stand going of it before it was attacked by a root fungus. It supposedly is very cold hardy and a knock out bloom. I tried it again 2 more times and never had the good results as the first time. My source doesn't carry it any more.

In general, I think it's possible to get blooms from some heliconia on new growth if the stand is large enough and the rhizome and root mass has enough energy, but the blooms don't ever seem to be as large.

Steve

luc vleeracker

Hi All ,

I am still struggling ( i am new ) to figure out how to work this site.

Anyway i am glad to find other heliconia growers , myself i have a decent collection and dont have the problem with cold since i live in Mexico.

Do some of you start from seeds or do you just buy the plants ? Since importing plants is difficult i would like to give the seeds a try.

Luc
Puerto Vallarta , Mexico

Steve L

Luc,

Welcome. I have only grown from rhizomes or plants. It's so much easier and gives you a big head start.

Steve

luc vleeracker

Hi Steve ,
I agree but all you have to do is order them , just for fun try to find a webpage on Heliconia in Mexico ,that's where i live , even in the nurseries they just have the classical ones like rostrata , wagneriana , psitacorum etc, extremely limited variety...fortunatly some like the latispatha grow wild in the jungle , i think we have about 12 varieties in the wild , but then again spread all over the country , distances are so big ,to drive to the next city takes my 3 to 4 hours...to go to the soutern state of Chiapas border with Guatemala would be a 2day drive, see the picture ?
Starting from seed is a challenge and one needs a lot of pacience , 2 to 3 years before you see a flower...on the other side you may end up with a different collor or hybrid that you can name yourself ....
If i would have access to all the places that can ship to the mainland us like Hawaai , Puerto Rico etc...i'd probably have 200 plus varieties growing.
Well ... nothing is easy in this world...every time i find a new H. that i dont have is like Xmas to me.

So long.

Luc

mnorell

Steve—

Thanks for the exhaustive rundown on everything. Sounds like you have the drainage thing pretty well under hand, perhaps the live oak canopy is a mixed blessing. Maybe for the borderline root-hardy single-season bloomers like Golden Torch and hirsuta it would be best to just let them go down in winter but have the added soil-warmth provided by sun-exposure during the day, and leave the shade and chill-tolerant types that need to overwinter their stems (schiediana, latispatha, etc.) under the live oaks. I guess I’ll find out something next spring since mine really don’t have anything overhead that is reliably evergreen, but they should get a good amount of sun on the soil (if the sun decides to shine, that is!)

Have you tried aurantiaca? These always look ratty to me, whether in my garden or in Miami at Fairchild…and I’ve just read something on the internet that says these grow in undisturbed (=dark) forest floors in Belize. But unfortunately I’m pretty sure they are very seasonal in blooming, and only do their thing in winter or spring. But I’m thinking I may move mine from a hot dry exposure in full sun to underneath a line of densely canopied cherry-laurel trees on a bank that gets some low-angle sun in winter but is pretty dim the rest of the year, but protected from rain (summer and winter). This would give the plant a lot of extra protection from the dense overhead as well as tall, dense holly ferns, aspidistra and tree-stumps at the top of the bank that provide a good windbreak. I had a lot of things come back (or overwinter without damage) in those conditions this past winter, though we had several hard freezes. My Zamia furfuracea stayed in pretty good shape until the final freeze in February when it lost the last of its leaves (and looks perfect now); Jacobinia carnea stayed fully evergreen, as did Philodendron selloum; and several other things did fine with some protective mulch. Even a small, struggling Alocasia ‘Sarian’ that I had rescued just before the cold from a soggy low-spot managed to come back (late) this season under that cherry-laurel canopy, while all other large specimens I had just flat-out croaked. So it’s a pretty good microclimate if the plant is shade-tolerant enough, and I’m thinking aurantiaca may be able to make it, as it’s by most accounts a shade-tolerant plant. I have one of my rostratas on the edge of that canopy so it can get some sun; I’m not sure how much shade these can take and still bloom.

One thing about seasonality: I saw someone’s post on the internet (from Hawai’i) saying that some Heliconias will do a seasonal trigger even if they have no leaves; a bud will apparently just sprout with a flower. Those listed were vaginalis and wagneriana. I’m thinking I’ve read that sometimes rostrata will throw up a flower without leaves, have you ever seen this? Also I wonder if this is what happened with your schiediana.

Very interesting about the chicken manure, and I’ll try to get some for next spring. I'm assuming it's particularly acid. I’ve often heard that Musa coccinea requires very acid soil, and I did work hard to put lots of peat into the soil around my strongest-growing mat, and gave one supplemental feeding of Miracid; but I’m wondering if you add the manure to that plant that it may explain its extreme vigor in your garden. I’ve heard other reports that coccinea will come back way up in zone 8, which surprises me a little since it seems so delicate. But perhaps the rhizome, once it’s attained a good size, is resistant to rotting in the cold and wet soil. It amazes me since this is such a spectacular flower, one would think just because “it’s always the case” that something like that would wilt and die at the lightest chill. Anything you can share on that front would be welcome here where I have searched for the plant for years, finally have a good source but managed to lose my small struggling specimen last year. I’d like to have some flowers this year (the largest one is on its 8th leaf right now and I’m still hopeful) and get these two mats to survive the winter. Nights will go into the 50s next month so I’m hoping September turns out to be a big-growth period. We had over 2” from Humberto yesterday and I swear things jumped up out of the ground with that nice ionized rain-water!

Have you tried any other of the Mexican species like spissa? Also I wonder about x nickeriensis, which is a hybrid between psittacorum and marginata. I don’t know about marginata’s provenance or cold-hardiness but I wonder if it’s hardier than psittacorum.

I’m going to look for fernandezii (though I can’t even find a picture of this one on the internet!) as well as some of the other cold-tolerant species like beckneri, bella, cordata, dielsiana and lanksteri, which are pretty cool-looking plants…all material for next winter’s homework!

Michael

JoeS475

Quick question: I have a potted Psittacorum 'Andromeda' with 7 flowers in various stages. Tonight will have a low of 40 degrees here. Should I bring it in, or will it be OK? This is my first heliconia and I have no clue about its hardiness!

Thanks!

~Joe

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